Outrageous dealer prices currently

[rdk654]

I was lured by a dealership in Las Vegas under the premise that they had allocation for a TRD Pro. Ended up marking up $23,000 above MSRP. Absolutely ridiculous.

Here in Nj, went to dealership to get a sport premium listed at 60k on window sticker. Took the test drive and went to purchase. Thats when they told me there was going to be a markup and told me all dealerships were doing it. Would t tell me how much. Called another dealership down the street and was informed the first dealership was a private dealer and they can do what they want but the one I was speaking too would honor the msrp.

 

[ModernDay4Runner]

Absolutely sure. They were claiming it was because it’d be the first TRD Pro for a long time in Las Vegas. The funny part is that the week after, another dealership reached out with a $10K markup. I’ve decided to wait and see.

Wow. Maybe they are thinking that some Vegas High Roller will have no qualms paying that much.

 

[ModernDay4Runner]

The “Outrageous dealer pricing currently” topic was originally my reply to another post about someone paying $75K for a Gen 6 4Runner. I saw on the sidebar on this forum that a moderator decided that this reply should be its own separate thread topic and retitled it.

I think the responses have uncovered that the 6Gen staff may be Toyota insiders -marketers or some of the parasitic ‘influencers’ I cited. Many of them make a living out of making videos about installing accessories and parts they get for free from suppliers and manufacturers. To each his own in a capitalistic society - I applaud them - but these people are not the typical Toyota buyer or user. They’re outliers as reflected in the nonsensical option combos most of us don’t want and are being forced fed.

Still think that the Toyota USA SUV/truck marketing team and its lead were unduly influenced by the ‘youtuber influencer’ & ‘overland expo’ gang. They have over-segmented the 4Runner Gen6/LC offerings and they are testing the Nash equilibrium with their overinflated pricing. That sales volume curve drops fairly steeply once the inelastic unit price point is exceeded. They’re close.

The dealers are not helping with useless tack-on accessory profit-driven pricing models and ‘market adjustments’. The problem may be worse in SET, but it’s not limited to my local market or to a single dealer. Not all dealers do it but enough do thate they smear the rest. One dealer in an adjoining state tried to charge me for a 2nd key fob for a TRD ORP 4Runner.

Obviously Toyota’s scheme of trickling the supply slowly is markedly distorting the market. They’ve always constrained supply to drive residual value and maintain inflated new truck pricing.

In the end, Toyota’s reputation is shattered, from my perspective, and they’ve decided to cater to the relatively few ‘internet Toyota influencers’ who make a living out of mods on their trucks by getting freebies from the suppliers, installers and Toyota aftermarket producers.

A pretty sleazy situation for an old line Japanese company that had spent so much of its storied history defending ‘human dignity’ through Lean/TPS innovation and quality. This new approach, at least in the USA, belies all that rhetoric as BS and a devout commitment to profit over quality.

Toyota seems to have lost its way.

Akio Toyoda-Sama, would you consider that the time has come for you to intervene in the USA market to correct the questionable dealer/distributor practices and misguided marketing strategy that are dishonoring Toyota’s reputation? Given the Toyoda family’s commitments to its loyal brand customer base, your leadership action now, to allow your customer’s who work hard to continue to afford your truck products, is the honorable course.

A couple things:

• "Obviously Toyota’s scheme of trickling the supply slowly is markedly distorting the market. They’ve always constrained supply to drive residual value and maintain inflated new truck pricing." Why then do you think they've recently lost their way? Non-sequitur
• If you think Akio Toyoda-Sama will take your sage advice, you may be giving yourself a bit too much credit or taking yourself a bit too seriously.
• Finally, I think you need to give us Gen 6 buyers a bit more credit. Looking at the distribution among these age groups of buyers and soon-to-be buyers, I highly doubt parasitic/you-tube influencers are the main reason people in these age groups are purchasing a new 4Runner.

 

[Xhale760]

Toyota Carlsbad has no mark ups on 4runners at least I didn't get one.

 

[toyomoLC]

A couple things:

• "Obviously Toyota’s scheme of trickling the supply slowly is markedly distorting the market. They’ve always constrained supply to drive residual value and maintain inflated new truck pricing." Why then do you think they've recently lost their way? Non-sequitur
• If you think Akio Toyoda-Sama will take your sage advice, you may be giving yourself a bit too much credit or taking yourself a bit too seriously.
• Finally, I think you need to give us Gen 6 buyers a bit more credit. Looking at the distribution among these age groups of buyers and soon-to-be buyers, I highly doubt parasitic/you-tube influencers are the main reason people in these age groups are purchasing a new 4Runner.

Its clear we disagree. To each his own.

My own solution was to find a 2023 5th Gen ORP+ with about 25K miles. I’ll pick it up Monday morning and drive it back a couple of hours. I found that dealers were asking up to $10K+ for essentially same Gen5 4Rs, so looking around and negotiating the price vigorously, walking away when warranted - something I’ve always done on car purchases - still works. Even in a market with people paying whatever dealers ask and taking whatever profit-generator useless options are shoveled into the cars by distributors and dealers.

I have no problem with anyone who’s ready to part with their money easily, I just don’t happen to be one of those buyers. YMMV

 

[rshally]

Found this! TRD Sport Premium - MSRP, No mark up or any add-ons except a upgrade paint (Wind Chill Pearl), Moonroof, and Tow Package. Processing fee is a bit steep.

 

[ModernDay4Runner]

Its clear we disagree. To each his own.

My own solution was to find a 2023 5th Gen ORP+ with about 25K miles. I’ll pick it up Monday morning and drive it back a couple of hours. I found that dealers were asking up to $10K+ for essentially same Gen5 4Rs, so looking around and negotiating the price vigorously, walking away when warranted - something I’ve always done on car purchases - still works. Even in a market with people paying whatever dealers ask and taking whatever profit-generator useless options are shoveled into the cars by distributors and dealers.

I have no problem with anyone who’s ready to part with their money easily, I just don’t happen to be one of those buyers. YMMV

You're right, to each his own. Me personally, I could never go back to a Gen5 after seeing the Gen6. They make the Gen5's look antiquated in my opinion. Don't get me wrong, I loved my Gen 5 the entire 8 years I owned it, but the Gen 6 is a game changer in my opinion and I too have no problem with how I spend my own money.

Let me ask you this. The Gen 6 haters on the other 4Runner forum were making claims that since the Gen 6 was released, the value of the Gen 5s have skyrocketed because the Gen 6 is destined to be a complete failure (in the minds of those people, anyways).

So how is the market for Gen 5s now that the Gen 6s are released. I am sure you didn't overpay, right? What has the value of Gen 5s done since release of the Gen 6, per your research?

 

[toyomoLC]

Based on what I’ve found so far used Gen 5 2023-2024s with 25K or less odometers in my area are priced close to or over their MSRP when they were new with zero mileage. Don’t know what they’re actually selling for.

I believe where prices are dropping are 4Rs in less popular colors or extensive aftermarket mods of unknown provenance. Condition still matters in how quickly they’re selling.

 

[ModernDay4Runner]

Based on what I’ve found so far used Gen 5 2023-2024s with 25K or less odometers in my area are priced close to or over their MSRP when they were new with zero mileage. Don’t know what they’re actually selling for.

I believe where prices are dropping are 4Rs in less popular colors or extensive aftermarket mods of unknown provenance. Condition still matters in how quickly they’re selling.

I thought you bought one that you'll be picking up Monday morning. You do know how much that one sold for as it relates to its price when brand new, right? Nobody made a profit on that deal I'll assume.

 

[BigTex4R]

Howdy folks - Sharing my first experience in hunting down an 2025 ORP...

Dealer had a specific allocation which hit all of the boxes. Show up, look at terms, consider a deposit, share ideal payment structure, then get their "first offer'...

Offer_1: With dealer mark-ups and 'market adjustments' added, $82K was their first offer out the door. Does not include the interest for the loan. Looking at $86-$88k all things considered. Immediately start considering what my GX550 could cost out the door. Very similar.

Quickly say no and push back. With a $12k down payment, perfect credit, trade-in sitting in my back pocket, and considering no more than a 60-mo finance term, they come back with a 12% APR offer. Not going to work. I bring up potentially coming out in cash (didn't say, but would get a credit union money loan at a better rate). Dealer said they would mark-up the vehicle 10% for cash offers.

Offer_2: Ok, we've got some adjustments here from the finance folk. How is a $1200 payment with the above terms? Still a no from me, say I won't pay over $800 a month max. I've run the numbers on my own and this is easily manageable/obtainable with the combination of my table items (e.g. down payment, credit, potential trade-in if necessary).

Offer_3: Sales folk sits with his finance team and, after a brief huddle, comes back with a new offer...This time, we're looking at $76k out the door (not including interest across the life of the loan). So, all things considered, about $82k. Not going to happen for an ORP.

Decide to walk out and give up the allocation to somebody else. Dealer wouldn't budge on their 'dealer-added mark ups' of $3,500 to essentially tint the windows and apply a clear coat on the paint 3x. Mark-up to 'adjust' for market shortage was $5k and non-negotiable. 12% APR was best they could do with an excellent credit score + history. Dealer wouldn't consider even a maximum 105% MSRP negotiation which I would consider if they offered competitive financing 6-9%.

Dealer lost my business on this one. On to the next dealer in the area. Don't settle, folks. Good luck!

 

[ModernDay4Runner]

Howdy folks - Sharing my first experience in hunting down an 2025 ORP...

Dealer had a specific allocation which hit all of the boxes. Show up, look at terms, consider a deposit, share ideal payment structure, then get their "first offer'...

Offer_1: With dealer mark-ups and 'market adjustments' added, $82K was their first offer out the door. Does not include the interest for the loan. Looking at $86-$88k all things considered. Immediately start considering what my GX550 could cost out the door. Very similar.

Quickly say no and push back. With a $12k down payment, perfect credit, trade-in sitting in my back pocket, and considering no more than a 60-mo finance term, they come back with a 12% APR offer. Not going to work. I bring up potentially coming out in cash (didn't say, but would get a credit union money loan at a better rate). Dealer said they would mark-up the vehicle 10% for cash offers.

Offer_2: Ok, we've got some adjustments here from the finance folk. How is a $1200 payment with the above terms? Still a no from me, say I won't pay over $800 a month max. I've run the numbers on my own and this is easily manageable/obtainable with the combination of my table items (e.g. down payment, credit, potential trade-in if necessary).

Offer_3: Sales folk sits with his finance team and, after a brief huddle, comes back with a new offer...This time, out the door we're looking at $76k out the door (not including interest across the life of the loan). So, all things considered, about $82k. Not going to happen for an ORP.

Decide to walk out and give up the allocation to somebody else. Dealer wouldn't budge on their 'dealer-added mark ups' of $3,500 to essentially tint the windows and apply a clear coat on the paint 3x. Mark-up to 'adjust' for market shortage was $5k and non-negotiable. 12% APR was best they could do with an excellent credit score + history. Dealer wouldn't consider even a maximum 105% MSRP negotiation which I would consider if they offered competitive financing 6-9%.

Dealer lost my business on this one. On to the next dealer in the area. Don't settle, folks. Good luck!

Every time I purchased a new car if the dealership asked me cash or finance, I replied to them that I just want to know the sale price of the vehicle and whatever fees there are. If a dealership is changing the price of the vehicle based on whether you finance or pay cash, me personally, I would walk away. The TRD sport premium I will soon be taking delivery of, I told the dealer what I was looking for. They soon got an allocation for a vehicle that had everything I wanted and a few things I didn't want but I'm okay with paying for like cross bars and floor mats. I would never pay for a dealer's paint protection package or the interior protection, that's pure profit for them, but anyways to each his own. The deal is at MSRP. The dealer never asked if I'm paying cash or financing. So it seems my deal was a lot less stressful than what you've been going through, I hope you find what you're looking for at a price that works for you.

 

[et2041]

Howdy folks - Sharing my first experience in hunting down an 2025 ORP...

Dealer had a specific allocation which hit all of the boxes. Show up, look at terms, consider a deposit, share ideal payment structure, then get their "first offer'...

Offer_1: With dealer mark-ups and 'market adjustments' added, $82K was their first offer out the door. Does not include the interest for the loan. Looking at $86-$88k all things considered. Immediately start considering what my GX550 could cost out the door. Very similar.

Quickly say no and push back. With a $12k down payment, perfect credit, trade-in sitting in my back pocket, and considering no more than a 60-mo finance term, they come back with a 12% APR offer. Not going to work. I bring up potentially coming out in cash (didn't say, but would get a credit union money loan at a better rate). Dealer said they would mark-up the vehicle 10% for cash offers.

Offer_2: Ok, we've got some adjustments here from the finance folk. How is a $1200 payment with the above terms? Still a no from me, say I won't pay over $800 a month max. I've run the numbers on my own and this is easily manageable/obtainable with the combination of my table items (e.g. down payment, credit, potential trade-in if necessary).

Offer_3: Sales folk sits with his finance team and, after a brief huddle, comes back with a new offer...This time, out the door we're looking at $76k out the door (not including interest across the life of the loan). So, all things considered, about $82k. Not going to happen for an ORP.

Decide to walk out and give up the allocation to somebody else. Dealer wouldn't budge on their 'dealer-added mark ups' of $3,500 to essentially tint the windows and apply a clear coat on the paint 3x. Mark-up to 'adjust' for market shortage was $5k and non-negotiable. 12% APR was best they could do with an excellent credit score + history. Dealer wouldn't consider even a maximum 105% MSRP negotiation which I would consider if they offered competitive financing 6-9%.

Dealer lost my business on this one. On to the next dealer in the area. Don't settle, folks. Good luck!

They're con artists. I'd tell them FU and walk.

 

[willb]

They will stop all that by summer I'm sure. In the Denver area I am not seeing any market adjustments and last I looked there were over 60 unreserved allocations around the city. Mostly non premium trims could be the reason why I guess.

I got a quote in Georgia for 14k above MSRP with an adjustment, nuts! Ended up getting mine by chance here in Colorado with no adjustment.